Would anybody be really surprised?...

hawaiianboy

hawaiianboy

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If we went balls out offensively this offseason?...

QB: JaMarcus Russell
RB: Darren McFadden (RD1)/ Michael Bush
FB: Justin Griffith/ Oren O'Neil

TE: Zach Miller/ John Madsen
SE: Chad Johnson (trade)
FL: Javon Walker (FA)
Slot: Ronald Curry


Some thoughts:

* We spent a lot of money and are putting a lot of faith into the development of JaMarcus Russell... Having WR's running free in the secondary to go along with the Tom Cable running game would benefit the 'face of the franchise'...

* I think it's a given that scoring a lot of points is the best thing a Raiders head coach can do to placate Al Davis and keep him off his back... You can't fix everything in one offseason, but fixing the offense would give Kiffin some elbow room with everything else the next couple of years while Al is looking at the pretty shiny lights being lit up on the scoreboard...

* I'm a defensive guy by nature, but even I know that it's a hell of a lot easier to play defense behind an offense that can score... You can be more aggressive and take chances when playing from the front end of the score board...


* Chad Johnson is weird, but I can handle weird if there is the kind of work ethic behind it that Johnson has, besides he has averaged over 90 catches and about 1400 yards a year the past five years... Javon Walker wasn't healthy this year, but if he'd be down with a one year prove yourself while spitting in the general direction of Shanahan deal, I'd look at him in that flanker spot... If not, you can spend a little more and get Bryant Johnson to play flanker...

I know the defense jihadist would pitch hissy fits, hell Crow may even suffer a brain aneurysm, but would it really surprise anyone if we took an aggressive approach with the offense while hoping for the year at least, that the new defensive coordinator could have a Tom Cable type of effect with the talent at hand plus some John Parrella/Bill Romanowski/ Rod Woodson type reasonablely priced FA adds?...


DE: Derrick Burgess
DT: Gerard Warren/ Keith Traylor (FA)
DT: Isaac Sopoaga (FA)/ Terdell Sands
DE: Jay Richardson
WLB: Thomas Howard
MLB: Kirk Morrison
SLB: Danny Clark (FA)
CB: Nnamdi Asomugha (Franchised)
CB: Stanford Routt
SS: Gibril Wilson (FA)
FS: Mike Huff

I am almost of the mind to really get behind completely revving the offense up this offseason, piece mealing together a Jacksonville-ish gap control style of approach to defense and then concentrate on adding to the defense next offseason... A lot of our problems stopping the run the past few years was a matter of positioning, which is somewhat a byproduct of a one gap get up the field scheme IMO...

Sorry, I'm just bored...
 
I would be...

short answer - our D is much farther along but needs a few key cogs before its complete. 2 DLs and an SS. on O we need at least 3 WRs, and some help along the OL while waiting for JaMarcus to mature.
 
I f we put some points on the board we wouldnt have to worry so much about the run D. The fact teams are always trying to run on us doesnt help.
 
BigTron said:
I f we put some points on the board we wouldnt have to worry so much about the run D. The fact teams are always trying to run on us doesnt help.
Click to expand...

So Basically your saying if we score early... say we get 2 touchdowns and a field goal and we are leading whatever opponent 17-0... then there forced to pass the ball to play catch up.

I like the idea.

But still i'm pretty set on evaluating these DT or DE cause there's some big units here which could change us from a good Defensive team to a LOCKDOWN Defensive Team.
 
BigTron said:
I f we put some points on the board we wouldnt have to worry so much about the run D. The fact teams are always trying to run on us doesnt help.
Click to expand...

I agree that if we had some quickstrike ability to force teams to pass more often we would win more games. However that would still require at least an SS upgrade and a DE. I'd rather just fix the D entirely and maybe add a Chad Johnson/Roy Williams/Larry Fitzgerald. I'm fine with our team being based on the run... getting a deep threat would compliment that. But our D needs to get patched before we do that.
 
thats the direction that I think they will go, if Mcfadden is there when we pic ar 3 or 4.

If not bpa for the d-line in rd1 and a playmaker in rd2. Whose that other kid from Arkanasa that plays rb and runs back kicks?
 
HBoy must have been having pineapple juice with Abelardo on New Years eve. :D
 
I'm definately down with the Javon Walker signing...

Good topic... rep.. but lemme ask ya HB.. Are you not satisfied from what you saw not only from Fargas this year but the just awesome effort Rhodes ran with the last two games

Hey man, Fargas broke 1000 yards in only what 7 starts?

And Rhodes busted a buck 35 on the Chargers

Do we really need to drop a 1st rd on a RB? I dig McFadden but this is a 100-115 rushing yard team every game regardless whos running.

I love the power running game and the stout defense over a flashy offense with a swiss cheese defense

I can dig the Javon Walker signing.. Chad Johnson? I'm assuming your trading our 2nd pick?

I'm all over that....

I would love to see Porter walk and bring in Chad Johnson and Javon Walker and Curry as our 3 WR's... that would be deadly...

Why not go that route and instead of drafting McFadden.. why not get Dorsey or Chris Long or even Gholston if they are there?
 
fatdog said:
thats the direction that I think they will go, if Mcfadden is there when we pic ar 3 or 4.

If not bpa for the d-line in rd1 and a playmaker in rd2. Whose that other kid from Arkanasa that plays rb and runs back kicks?
Click to expand...


Nothing Al does surprises me, but I don't think it's the direction we will go. I think we'll push hard to get Fargas resigned. I think Rhodes made his case to be back next season and we'll finally get a look at Bush next season. I would not be all that unhappy with that trio.

You referring to Felix Jones?
 
Madturk said:
Nothing Al does surprises me, but I don't think it's the direction we will go. I think we'll push hard to get Fargas resigned. I think Rhodes made his case to be back next season and we'll finally get a look at Bush next season. I would not be all that unhappy with that trio.

You referring to Felix Jones?
Click to expand...

Ya Felix Jones. He should be there in the 2nd and he returns kicks too.
 
Ugly Nipples said:


but lemme ask ya HB.. Are you not satisfied from what you saw not only from Fargas this year but the just awesome effort Rhodes ran with the last two games
Click to expand...

Fair question... while I'm satisfied with Fargas, I'm not convinced he can replicate it over a 2-3 year time frame... His history from USC on certainly does not back it up...

I think it all comes down to the draft for need vs draft the best player available argument... While there are some intruiging defensive prospects, I just don't know if I see the kind of superstar return you'd expect out of a top 5 pick... I've had enough of "solid" returns on our top 10 pick investments... While I have some questions about how he was used, I think McFadden is the most likely to hit superstar level of all the players in this draft...

The question is are we better off putting the combined money Rhodes is set to receive and the money we'd have to use to resign Fargas and go get some free agent players at spots of need and go ahead and take the shot with the talent of McFadden...

Having Kenny King coming off a couple of solid seasons, didn't stop us from drafting Marcus Allen, and having Marcus Allen didn't stop us from going out and getting Bo... I just keep thinking back to how fun it was and how much it benefited the passing game when we had a Wheatley/Nip and Wheatley/Garner one-two punch... The prospect of having a duo with the kind of star level talent a McFadden/Bush pairing has is very, very exciting... Especially with what both can do as receivers coming out of the backfield, a dimension currently missing with Fargas...


Bottom line I guess is I'm not completely sold on the defensive guys at the next level, especially the DT's... McFadden may be the BPA at the #1 slot, much less the #3 or 4 hole...
 
hawaiianboy said:
If we went balls out offensively this offseason?...

QB: JaMarcus Russell
RB: Darren McFadden (RD1)/ Michael Bush
FB: Justin Griffith/ Oren O'Neil

TE: Zach Miller/ John Madsen
SE: Chad Johnson (trade)
FL: Javon Walker (FA)
Slot: Ronald Curry


Some thoughts:

* We spent a lot of money and are putting a lot of faith into the development of JaMarcus Russell... Having WR's running free in the secondary to go along with the Tom Cable running game would benefit the 'face of the franchise'...

* I think it's a given that scoring a lot of points is the best thing a Raiders head coach can do to placate Al Davis and keep him off his back... You can't fix everything in one offseason, but fixing the offense would give Kiffin some elbow room with everything else the next couple of years while Al is looking at the pretty shiny lights being lit up on the scoreboard...

* I'm a defensive guy by nature, but even I know that it's a hell of a lot easier to play defense behind an offense that can score... You can be more aggressive and take chances when playing from the front end of the score board...


* Chad Johnson is weird, but I can handle weird if there is the kind of work ethic behind it that Johnson has, besides he has averaged over 90 catches and about 1400 yards a year the past five years... Javon Walker wasn't healthy this year, but if he'd be down with a one year prove yourself while spitting in the general direction of Shanahan deal, I'd look at him in that flanker spot... If not, you can spend a little more and get Bryant Johnson to play flanker...

I know the defense jihadist would pitch hissy fits, hell Crow may even suffer a brain aneurysm, but would it really surprise anyone if we took an aggressive approach with the offense while hoping for the year at least, that the new defensive coordinator could have a Tom Cable type of effect with the talent at hand plus some John Parrella/Bill Romanowski/ Rod Woodson type reasonablely priced FA adds?...


DE: Derrick Burgess
DT: Gerard Warren/ Keith Traylor (FA)
DT: Isaac Sopoaga (FA)/ Terdell Sands
DE: Jay Richardson
WLB: Thomas Howard
MLB: Kirk Morrison
SLB: Danny Clark (FA)
CB: Nnamdi Asomugha (Franchised)
CB: Stanford Routt
SS: Gibril Wilson (FA)
FS: Mike Huff

I am almost of the mind to really get behind completely revving the offense up this offseason, piece mealing together a Jacksonville-ish gap control style of approach to defense and then concentrate on adding to the defense next offseason... A lot of our problems stopping the run the past few years was a matter of positioning, which is somewhat a byproduct of a one gap get up the field scheme IMO...

Sorry, I'm just bored...
Click to expand...

What can I say, I like these ideas.
 
It's too bad that Dallas doesn't have higher #1's. We could really stockpile some nice picks if Jerry Jones is as enamored with DMac as purported.
 
hawaiianboy said:
If we went balls out offensively this offseason?...

QB: JaMarcus Russell
RB: Darren McFadden (RD1)/ Michael Bush
FB: Justin Griffith/ Oren O'Neil

TE: Zach Miller/ John Madsen
SE: Chad Johnson (trade)
FL: Javon Walker (FA)
Slot: Ronald Curry


Some thoughts:

* We spent a lot of money and are putting a lot of faith into the development of JaMarcus Russell... Having WR's running free in the secondary to go along with the Tom Cable running game would benefit the 'face of the franchise'...

* I think it's a given that scoring a lot of points is the best thing a Raiders head coach can do to placate Al Davis and keep him off his back... You can't fix everything in one offseason, but fixing the offense would give Kiffin some elbow room with everything else the next couple of years while Al is looking at the pretty shiny lights being lit up on the scoreboard...

* I'm a defensive guy by nature, but even I know that it's a hell of a lot easier to play defense behind an offense that can score... You can be more aggressive and take chances when playing from the front end of the score board...


* Chad Johnson is weird, but I can handle weird if there is the kind of work ethic behind it that Johnson has, besides he has averaged over 90 catches and about 1400 yards a year the past five years... Javon Walker wasn't healthy this year, but if he'd be down with a one year prove yourself while spitting in the general direction of Shanahan deal, I'd look at him in that flanker spot... If not, you can spend a little more and get Bryant Johnson to play flanker...

I know the defense jihadist would pitch hissy fits, hell Crow may even suffer a brain aneurysm, but would it really surprise anyone if we took an aggressive approach with the offense while hoping for the year at least, that the new defensive coordinator could have a Tom Cable type of effect with the talent at hand plus some John Parrella/Bill Romanowski/ Rod Woodson type reasonablely priced FA adds?...


DE: Derrick Burgess
DT: Gerard Warren/ Keith Traylor (FA)
DT: Isaac Sopoaga (FA)/ Terdell Sands
DE: Jay Richardson
WLB: Thomas Howard
MLB: Kirk Morrison
SLB: Danny Clark (FA)
CB: Nnamdi Asomugha (Franchised)
CB: Stanford Routt
SS: Gibril Wilson (FA)
FS: Mike Huff

I am almost of the mind to really get behind completely revving the offense up this offseason, piece mealing together a Jacksonville-ish gap control style of approach to defense and then concentrate on adding to the defense next offseason... A lot of our problems stopping the run the past few years was a matter of positioning, which is somewhat a byproduct of a one gap get up the field scheme IMO...

Sorry, I'm just bored...
Click to expand...

It wouldn't surprise me, but it would definitely disappoint me.

As much as I want to go DL in Rd1, if McFadden is there, I won't exactly slit my wrists if we take him.

But, since we're playing this game...and you know how much I love this game (It's a lot like masturbation, and we all love that)...lemme drop a deuce on ya.


QB: Russell, Walter, whoever
RB: Bush, Rhodes, Mike Hart (Rd4), Mewelde Moore
FB: Griffith, O'Neal
WR: Curry, Bryant Johnson (FA), Ernest Wilford (FA), Madsen, Higgins, Dwight
TE: Miller, Stewart, Wakefield

Solid. Not spectacular, but it doesn't need to be.

A host of reliable WRs, all with good size who are exceptional blockers...except for Dwight and Higgins, who bring the vertical speed to open up the underneath routes. The immediate upside to this approach is that we don't have to wait for a WR to develop. Seasoned youth at WR. Should make Russell's development much easier.

Banking too much on Bush? Maybe a little. But by retaining Rhodes, we have a proven 1000 yard rusher and good check-down receiver. Hart has a lot of mileage on him, but he's a hard nosed runner who simply doesn't fumble (except for today, oddly enough).

Mewelde Moore is a terrific receiver and a shifty runner who could really open some eyes in this system. He'll also come pretty cheap and could even take over as our RS.

I'm assuming Fargas prices himself out of the range of your typical platoon back. As such, we let him walk, hope someone overpays for him, and wait for the comp pick next year.


Now, let's spend some money the right way. :cool:


LE: Burgess, Richardson, Brayton
DT: Glenn Dorsey (Rd1), Warren
DT: Pat Williams (FA), Red Bryant (Rd2)
RE: Justin Smith (FA), Chris Clemons (FA)

OLB: Thomas, Ezra Butler/Beau Bell (Rd4)
MLB: Morrison, Ekejiuba
OLB: Howard, Alston, Brown

CB: Aso (tag), Carr, Johnson
S: Huff, Cooper, Carr, Gibril Wilson (FA)
CB: Routt, Washington, Bowie

Thought hard about adding Jack's boy Corey Williams, but I think he's going to command Haynesworth caliber $. So, may as well not give either much thought.

Pat Williams is getting up in years, only plays on 1st and 2nd down, and may not be thrilled with the idea of leaving an up & coming team in Minnesota. But if we dangle a decent signing bonus under his nose, he may decide to follow the money. An elite run stuffer, and who better to help groom our rookie Bryant into becoming the same thing?

Justin Smith, after a down year and an embarrassing season to be a Bengal, may come a little cheaper than expected. He's the type of every down end who could really help our run defense while also getting pressure on the QB from our base package.

Retaining Clemons should be a priority. As a nickle passrusher, he's been the cliche's "pleasant surprise". He could also prove to be a good option at SAM.

With the upgrades to the D-line, I didn't see the use in blowing a wad on the SAM position. Between Thomas, Clemons, and a 4th round rook, I think we're good there.

Kiffin basically said that he wants to move Huff around in the secondary, probably to FS.

Cooper could probably handle an increased role as a part-time box safety, but we definitely need to add more and better players here.

Gibril Wilson is no world beater. But he should be enough to allow Huff to move to centerfield.

Ken Hamlin's Pro Bowl nod basically prices him out of our range.


I'd like to see us trade back into Rd3 this year. If we do, taking a safety will be tempting. But I think we should probably use that pick on a potential LT replacement for Sims or a project center to take over for Newberry.
 
Wow.

So we're going to sign Bryant Johnson, Justin Smith, Pat Williams, Gibril Wilson, Ernest Wilford and Mewelde Moore?

We'll be lucky to sign one of those players man.

Seriously, is there any team in the league that has been less attractive for free agents than Oakland over the last 5 seasons?

I could see us getting an outside shot at landing one big name guy in a trade, or maybe one big signing, not the two best free agent DL, the top FA safety and two of the top wideouts...Thats silly.
 
I'm not against the idea.. I think most of us are anticipating alotta effort towards the offense this offseason... I mean everyone's(including me) been whining about needing some playmakers on that side of the ball, and Kiffin has come out several times talking about needing to bring the talent level on offense up to JaMarcus' so something like what you've laid out here wouldn't surprise me.

I assume that we wouldn't spend that #1 on Mcfadden becasue of the combination of talent on the D-line in the draft that matches our need, and the proven talent and system rushing the ball that's now in place, but you're definatly right that the offense is what gets Al off. Most of the big deals I recall Al making involve offensive players.... Gault, Bo, Schroder, Moss, ect, so I can definatly see it happen.

I can really go either way. I have total trust in Kiffin's direction, and he's a guy that agressivly goes after what he want's so we probably will see some surprising offensive fireworks this offseason.

I also think you make a good point about the offense helping the defense, I have no doubt that that patriot offense covers up a really not so special patrot D.
 
Crow said:
WR: Curry, Bryant Johnson (FA), Ernest Wilford (FA), Madsen, Higgins, Dwight
Click to expand...

This looks like a horrible WR corp, much like the one we already have... alotta lateral moves in there.

I don't believe Kiff or Al will stand for that. I really think we'll end up with one of the big name WR's being talked about being available, even if it's only Walker.
 
Raiderfan007 said:
Wow.

So we're going to sign Bryant Johnson, Justin Smith, Pat Williams, Gibril Wilson, Ernest Wilford and Mewelde Moore?

We'll be lucky to sign one of those players man.

Seriously, is there any team in the league that has been less attractive for free agents than Oakland over the last 5 seasons?

I could see us getting an outside shot at landing one big name guy in a trade, or maybe one big signing, not the two best free agent DL, the top FA safety and two of the top wideouts...Thats silly.
Click to expand...
The top FA safety? Who? Wilson? Bwahaha! Okay.

And if you couldn't tell by my preface, or HB's original post, this is all boredom-induced mental masturbation.

Try to keep up.
 
Byron2112 said:
This looks like a horrible WR corp, much like the one we already have... alotta lateral moves in there.

I don't believe Kiff or Al will stand for that. I really think we'll end up with one of the big name WR's being talked about being available, even if it's only Walker.
Click to expand...

I hope not. Knee injuries, bitchy attitudes, and overinflated sense of worth leading to excessive asking prices? I'll pass.

Also, there's no lateral moves there. Just because the names aren't flashy doesn't mean they're not noteworthy upgrades. Big name WRs are for teams dumb enough to overpay for them. I'd prefer to not be the dummy who gets jobbed by Javon Walker, Chad Johnson, etc. All have good game, but none are mentally stable enough to thrive on a bad team like ours.

We shit the bed with Moss. Let's not do it again.
 
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