Will Rob Ryan return next season?

BigTron

BigTron

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2006
Messages
17,342
Reaction score
16,238
We get ran on all day long by everyone. We cant tackle. We never get any pressure on QB's. Farve was hurt and we didnt get in face all day. If your D-Line isnt good enough to get pressure than bring someone else to help. Thomas Howard runs a 4.4, you tell me he cant chase Farve? I dont think Ryan will be back next year, he hasnt shown me anything this season. And the fatc our passing D is good has little to do with him. Its because people pound the ball on us and are never trailing. That and we draft DB's in round 1 every other year.

Is it the roster or is Rob Ryan an imposter? Thier are teams with less or equal talent on D playing WAY better than us.
 
I assume Kiffin will get the green light to go out and get his own guy to be the DC...

And I couldnt care less. Ryan had what? 4 years? We've seen improvement in areas and progression in some players, but his overall body of work leaves much to be desired.

At the end of the day, we've had a bottom 10 defence for 4 out of the last 5 years, and last year seems more like an anomaly than the norm.
 
BigTron said:
We get ran on all day long by everyone. We cant tackle. We never get any pressure on QB's. Farve was hurt and we didnt get in face all day. If your D-Line isnt good enough to get pressure than bring someone else to help. Thomas Howard runs a 4.4, you tell me he cant chase Farve? I dont think Ryan will be back next year, he hasnt shown me anything this season. And the fatc our passing D is good has little to do with him. Its because people pound the ball on us and are never trailing. That and we draft DB's in round 1 every other year.

Is it the roster or is Rob Ryan an imposter? Thier are teams with less or equal talent on D playing WAY better than us.
Click to expand...

I think you can make a strong case to get rid of the entire coaching staff if you really wanted to.... Ryan's defense has regressed in all phases this year, so it's easy to point the finger at him. The Raiders never lost by more than 30 points under Norval or Shell... so you could just as easily point the finger at Kiffin.

The way I see it, I'm not convinced the problem lies on the sidelines this year. I think we're getting destroyed in the trenches. Kiffin does not have NFL caliber talent at the majority of the OLine while Ryan does not have NFL caliber talent at the majority of the DLine. I'm not sure you can blame the cooks if the idiot buying the groceries is a fool.
 
SoCalRaider said:
I think you can make a strong case to get rid of the entire coaching staff if you really wanted to.... Ryan's defense has regressed in all phases this year, so it's easy to point the finger at him. The Raiders never lost by more than 30 points under Norval or Shell... so you could just as easily point the finger at Kiffin.

The way I see it, I'm not convinced the problem lies on the sidelines this year. I think we're getting destroyed in the trenches. Kiffin does not have NFL caliber talent at the majority of the OLine while Ryan does not have NFL caliber talent at the majority of the DLine. I'm not sure you can blame the cooks if the idiot buying the groceries is a fool.
Click to expand...

I agree with you about needing some quality line players. But Ryan has played Grant Irons and Brayton at OLB, Sapp at 3-4 DE, he stuck with Swagg at FS instead of putting Huff in his natural position, he was all about re-signing Sands... He had to have helped scout Moses.... I dunno he has worn out his chance. How many years do we need to get run all over before we start manning up? Its not all Ryans fault but i dont feel like he gameplans AT ALL.
 
BigTron said:
I agree with you about needing some quality line players. But Ryan has played Grant Irons and Brayton at OLB, Sapp at 3-4 DE, he stuck with Swagg at FS instead of putting Huff in his natural position, he was all about re-signing Sands... He had to have helped scout Moses.... I dunno he has worn out his chance. How many years do we need to get run all over before we start manning up? Its not all Ryans fault but i dont feel like he gameplans AT ALL.
Click to expand...

Outside of Sapp.... all those other guys you mentioned are the kind of riff raff we need to do a better job of weeding out in the draft. I'm still inclined to blame the guy drafting all those good for nothing nobodies. Sapp, on the other hand, was a mistake to move to 3-4 end.... but to Ryan's credit, he ended that experiment in the latter part of that initial year.

As for the gameplanning... there's been a lot of chatter that Al is still very involved in the defensive confusion/game plans...
 
The glitter has come off both Ryan boys somewhat this year...

Sometimes the best thing that can happen is for the players to hear a different voice and to get a fresh set of eyes evaluating them...

The second level breakdowns have been a consistent problem this year, as has shoddy tackling... Some of it is talent, but a lot of it is players just being out of position... The scheme in itself tends to get the players shoulders turned sideways with the D-line shooting gaps and the LB's in a chase mode... Too often the players aren't able to get their shoulders back to square which leads to missed tackles... Odd because Ryan came from such a gap control scheme with the Pats...

It's really disturbing that we're such a fundamentally poor tackling team... That IMO, has very little to do with talent level... It would be one thing if we were squaring up to make tackles and getting steamrolled by a superior players, but we're just flat out out of position and trying to arm tackle for the most part...

Ryan is somewhat limited because I don't think he can limit Sapp to situational snaps even if he wanted to and because we're God awful at free safety, then again asking a guy like Schweigert to do something beyond his talent level is on the coach, no different than asking Jordan to stay in and block elite pass rushers last year IMO... Overall, I've been underwhelmed with what Ryan has done this year... It really pisses me off when DC's don't switch up the presnap reads they give QB's.. Personally I want the QB, O-line and WR's thinking as much as possible before that ball is snapped... We're not good enough to just say "here we are, do what you can", we need to do what we can to force mental mistakes and miscommunication...

I'm pretty sure we gave Ryan a two year deal after we let Norv go, so he may end up with Mangini or somewhere else whether we would want him back or not.... If we do part ways, there are some pretty interesting options with close ties to Lane with Pops Kiffin, Ed Orgeron and Ken Norton Jr to name a few... but knowing Al, he'll probably just look to promote a guy already on staff with time remaining on his contract much the way he did with Bres after Gru wanted Shaw out... There would be worse things than ending up with Keith Millard or Darren Perry taking over, but I believe the head coach should decide what kind of scheme he wants to run and who to lead it since ultimatley it is his ass that's on the line, especially as it pertains to the Raiders....
 
Rob Ryan gets a pass from a lot of casual fans because of that mirage of a good defense that was put up last season

honestly, i think we have the dumbest scheme in the league

we constantly rush 4 and play man-to-man. QBs have ample time to throw, and 1-on-1 matchups are almost always a WR advantage.

i dont know if it is ryan, or Al tying his hands behind his back, but this defense is not good by any means

the personell may not be there on the d-line, but there is no excuse for looking that bad
 
I honestly preferred Bresnahan's blitzes and secondary confusion. Sometimes the opposition didn't have the time to see how confused our secondary was.

The last ten seasons I've had more "Oh God!" moments with our defense on the field than I prefer.

I don't buy the Al's the coach line of thinking. The only way he's tying Ryan's hands is with the personnel he gives him. That's bad enough isn't it? For example, letting him try to field a 3-4 with 4-3 personnel, 4 LBs on the roster? And some of those converted "rush-backers" weren't much in the pass rush department before we "converted" them. Sickening.

It's a good thing Kiffin knows a thing or two about defense, so I would expect he already knows who he wants to keep and who's getting the bums rush. That would make bringing in a new coordinator an easier transition. With Kiffin's new guy, the "direct link to Al" could be severed, and we could stop making those lame excuses.
 
SoCalRaider said:
but to Ryan's credit, he ended that experiment in the latter part of that initial year.
Click to expand...

No credit to Ryan there. That order came down from On High. As Sapp put it, the big man upstairs made him stop that bullshit.
 
IMHO, it more personnel than it is coaching. I hope to fucking HELL that they don't dump Ryan and keep the same shit. They need to dump all the shit before Ryan. Bring in Kiff? Ya sure, but ya better give him some fucking PLAYERS or the same god damn results will occur.
 
Oh, I definitely agree that the DL needs to be blown up. But I don't think retaining Ryan is going to do anything for us either way.

3 new DTs
At least 1 new DE, preferably 2.
4-6 new coaches on the defensive side of the ball, all of which coming from programs known for their fundamentals and sound tackling.
Season to taste.
 
hawaiianboy said:
It's really disturbing that we're such a fundamentally poor tackling team... That IMO, has very little to do with talent level... It would be one thing if we were squaring up to make tackles and getting steamrolled by a superior players, but we're just flat out out of position and trying to arm tackle for the most part...
Click to expand...



Maybe I'm remembering wrong, but wasn't this one a the bright spots last season?

We were still getting pushed around on the line, but at least were wrapping up and holding on...?
 
RZ said:
IMHO, it more personnel than it is coaching. I hope to fucking HELL that they don't dump Ryan and keep the same shit. They need to dump all the shit before Ryan. Bring in Kiff? Ya sure, but ya better give him some fucking PLAYERS or the same god damn results will occur.
Click to expand...
I disagree. Granted we've changed quite a few players on offense, but we sure as hell didn't pick up anything substantially better than what we already had, we picked up guys who knew the system we'd be using on the OL. And what are our results? We're already more credible than last season on offense. We've got more wins even though our defense has dropped from 3rd overall in yards to 24th and 18th in points to 20th. (Yeah, I know, KC and Denver both got worse and we beat them both this year to account for the win differential - I know, I know, good argument, glad you brought it up).

Kiffin came in and kept essentially the same shit and improved the offense. Do we need to dump the rest of the average and shit guys on offense to become top-tier? Yes. But the point is we improved by improving the coaching.

Just like last season, when guys were making all sorts of reasonable suggestions for the offense to improve the results. There are plenty of reasonable suggestions to improve the defensive results. The fact that so few of them are being used is as frustrating this season on defense as they were last season on offense.

I watched a lot of other games yesterday, and saw a lot of less talented defenders (physically) in position to makes plays our guys weren't making yesterday. In my book, that's all on the coaching.

The way I see it you make the most of what you've got. I don't see Ryan doing that.
 
Rupert said:
The way I see it you make the most of what you've got. I don't see Ryan doing that.
Click to expand...
I agree. We have 3 first-round picks in the d-backfield (that's some serious talent if nothing else), 2 stellar young LBs with great speed and instincts, a 7-time pro bowl DT and a pro bowl DE.

You can't rush the passer, you can't defend the run and your DBs are always set up to fail because of those 2 problems. SOMEBODY has to go. Ryan it is.
 
Dropping a 300lb DT back into coverage did it for me. Or how about the Cle game where we dropped all 11 guys back and Cle got in easy fg range? I've had enough of Ryan's unimaginative and unagressive schemes.
 
Rupert said:

The last ten seasons I've had more "Oh God!" moments with our defense on the field than I prefer.
Click to expand...

"Oh God" would be the PG-13 version for me...:pound:

For example, letting him try to field a 3-4 with 4-3 personnel, 4 LBs on the roster? And some of those converted "rush-backers" weren't much in the pass rush department before we "converted" them. Sickening
Click to expand...
.

The most telling part of that failed defense is that everyone outside of Brayton that we put in those key rushbacker positions are out of the league... DeLawrence Grant, Grant Irons, Akbar-Giagisbilabila, Travian Smith... I'll never understand it, you clearly target coaches that were running the 34 (Mangini, both Ryans) to hire and then scrimp on the very thing that makes the defense go....
 
HB: I usually say "Oh God!" when we're in a decent to very good position defensively and see the defense we use. It usually gets the R rating after the play's over. It often starts with "God" though. I've had very few, "Nice" or "Okay" moments on 3rd down, which is damned frustrating. I mean, I say, "It's about time." so infrequently it's pathetic.

When everyone was talking about Ryan coming in here to run the 3-4 I kept saying I'd believe it when I see it. And then he converted all the DE's and I wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I kept wondering if Al wanted another Mad Stork, but he didn't seem to get that Hendricks was more like a late-college early-NBA power forward than the typical college DE (yeah today he's more of a 3 than a 4). He was tall and rangy. The guys we ran out there were much heavier than Hendricks, even though they were shorter.
 
Al Davis isnt as involved withthe defense as people think. Kiffin at one point said he hadnt talked to Al in weeks. If thats the case I doubt he is making moves with our D. He is involved during the offseason IMO.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top