Whither Brady Quinn?

Some guys at the combine talked Quinn into lifting. He threw up 24 reps.
I watched him do it. Really I don't see what is wrong with Brady Quinn. He doesn't' win big games? Does russell? I haven't seen nearly as many games of Russell as Quinn but they say in the BIG games Russell's int percentage goes way up and he's just been average.

Quinn looks to me like the best QB prospect. Russell is a real gamble. I love Quinn's attitude and his confidence. Yeah the dude looks ripped to be sure. He's big, has a very good arm and he's smart and can move some...something wrong with that?

A year ago the Raider Nation would have killed to draft Brady Quinn...now he's dogshit? I say trade down...get Quinn and somehow get back into the first round to drafty Lynch. What ever happened to the Moss to GB idea. I love that trade.

Really I think Al can bend somebody over to trade down and pick up more picks and get Quinn. Frankly we wouldn't be talking about this crap if we had just pulled the trigger on Leinart last year. Pisses me off. Wasted a friggin' year.

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For comparison's sake:

Joe Thomas threw up something like 28...

Quinn is jacked.
 
I watched him do it. Really I don't see what is wrong with Brady Quinn. He doesn't' win big games? Does russell? I haven't seen nearly as many games of Russell as Quinn but they say in the BIG games Russell's int percentage goes way up and he's just been average.

Quinn looks to me like the best QB prospect. Russell is a real gamble. I love Quinn's attitude and his confidence. Yeah the dude looks ripped to be sure. He's big, has a very good arm and he's smart and can move some...something wrong with that?

A year ago the Raider Nation would have killed to draft Brady Quinn...now he's dogshit? I say trade down...get Quinn and somehow get back into the first round to drafty Lynch. What ever happened to the Moss to GB idea. I love that trade.

Really I think Al can bend somebody over to trade down and pick up more picks and get Quinn. Frankly we wouldn't be talking about this crap if we had just pulled the trigger on Leinart last year. Pisses me off. Wasted a friggin' year.

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I'm actually not so against taking Quinn, I don't know enough about either QB to know for sure if Russell is the guy or not.

But I'd feel better if we came out with one of them.

I certainly understand the "don't take a QB" crowd. I'm just not in that camp. If neither guy was good enough to be considered at the top of the draft, I don't think teams would consider them. Of course scouts aren't infallible, but these guys need to be scouted on their own merits, not compared to players from past drafts, and where those players rank.
 
Just Quinn

The battle continues ----
Irish's Quinn makes case for No. 1 choice over Russell


Posted: Friday February 23, 2007 8:10PM; Updated: Friday February 23, 2007 8:10PM

Based on his two-year tutorial under Charlie Weis, Brady Quinn believes he's the draft's most prepared QB for NFL success.

Damian Strohmeyer/SI


INDIANAPOLIS (AP) -- Brady Quinn isn't ready to admit defeat in the race to be the top pick in the NFL draft.

Seven weeks since JaMarcus Russell shot up the draft chart after beating Quinn in the Sugar Bowl, Quinn delivered his first major rebuttal in the competition to be selected first overall in April.

"I'd tell them I'm the most prepared collegiate player in the draft," Quinn said Friday at the annual NFL scouting combine. "There's not one other player in college that's had the coaching I've had in the last two years, and I feel I'm the best leader."

Now it's up to the NFL scouts and coaches to make their judgments.

Like great draft debates of the past -- Drew Bledsoe or Rick Mirer, Peyton Manning or Ryan Leaf, Eli Manning or Philip Rivers, Vince Young or Matt Leinart -- this one could be risky.

Russell offers a rare blend of size, mobility and strength. He measured-in Friday at 6-foot-6, 265 pounds -- nine pounds heavier than his playing weight.

Russell says he can throw a football 83 or 84 yards, but it wasn't until he led LSU to a 41-14 victory over Quinn and Notre Dame in the Sugar Bowl that he gained national prominence. Less than a week after the game, when Russell heard he was projected as a first-round pick, he announced he was leaving school early.

"I'd been through a few games that went well and we found a way to pull them out," Russell said. "Sometimes you get the recognition, sometimes you don't. But that bowl game really helped."

Even though this draft class contains other talented quarterbacks such as Heisman Trophy winner Troy Smith from Ohio State and Chris Leak, who led Florida to the national championship, most considered Quinn the best.

That changed after Quinn injured his knee against Southern Cal and aggravated it in the Sugar Bowl. Doctors advised him to sit out the Senior Bowl, and Russell soon moved ahead in the rankings.

With Oakland holding the top pick, and Al Davis' philosophy of throwing deep, Russell seemed like the odds-on favorite to go first. They even cleared a spot Thursday by letting Aaron Brooks go.

Quinn says not so fast.

Like Russell, Quinn won't work out in Indianapolis. He was measured at 6-3, 232 pounds and has scheduled two pro days at Notre Dame -- March 4 and March 22 -- in an attempt to reclaim top-pick status.

"I had three goals coming into the season," Quinn said. "I wanted to win a national championship, win the Heisman and be the No. 1 pick in the draft. The first two didn't work out so well. The third we'll have to see."

Quinn has several advantages. Playing in Charlie Weis' pro-style offense may make for a smoother transition from college to the NFL. Weis also has a reputation for turning quarterbacks into stars. His prized pupil is three-time Super Bowl winner Tom Brady of New England.

Quinn, who threw for 93 touchdowns and more than 11,500 yards, cannot be pegged as a system quarterback since he also played in Tyrone Willingham's West Coast offense, another staple in the NFL.

And with the exposure Notre Dame typically receives on any given week, Quinn has proven he can handle pressure similar to what an NFL quarterback faces.

Russell, however, is believed to have more potential. He threw for more than 6,000 yards at LSU, where he was 25-4 as a starter, and many around the league think he's still improving.

It's a quandary teams seem to face each year.

Not surprisingly, college teammates of Quinn and Russell at the combine take opposing views.

"I definitely believe he (Quinn) is the quarterback in the draft by far," said running back Darius Walker, who played at Notre Dame. "Nobody has the ability he has to read defenses and the experience in the system that he's played under."

Wide receiver Dwayne Bowe, who played with Russell at LSU, counters: "He's ready to get things rolling and make an impact on any team he's going to."

Ultimately, the decision rests with the team's decision-makers.

Cleveland general manager Phil Savage, who has known Russell since he was in the seventh grade, likes Russell's skills, but maybe not enough to trade up from the No. 3 spot to pick him.

"He is coming out as a junior, which would lead you to believe there might be some upside, and he's played in a pro-style system," Savage said.

But Quinn remains confident he can win this debate.

"It's hard to slip when you haven't done anything," he said. "I've been thinking 'Did someone see me miss a rep in the weight room or something?'

"We worked out in Tempe, Arizona, together and, obviously we played against each other in the bowl game. There's a competitiveness there, but you can't control what a team does. You can only put yourself in the best possible position to succeed, and that's what I intend to do."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/nfl/02/23/quinn.draft.ap/index.html
 
It's a huge crap shoot taking a quarterback, particularly with the first overall pick so to me it's not that big of a deal if we pull the trigger on Russell or Quinn. I just thought after the Sugar bowl that it was obvious who the better quarterback was. Quinn was ripped beyond belief at the weigh in and Russell was a little softer but just looked naturally big and strong. He's like the kid who doesn't have to study very hard and still pulls down the higher g.p.a.

In a perfect world Andrew Walter will progress nicely in his second year as a starter and we could pass on the qb in this draft and take Peterson or CJ. Those two appear to be the safest/best prospects in the entire class. That said, my wish list still goes in the following order:

1. Adrian Peterson
2. JaMarcus Russell
3. Calvin Johnson
4. Joe Thomas
 
Interesting, though I don't buy it... I don't think Quinn slips out of the top 8 if that... Be nice to trade down a few spots and get Quinn as well as a pick or three...

From PFT:

STANTON LEAPFROGGING QUINN?


One of the darlings of the scouting combine is Michigan State quarterback Drew Stanton. Word is that several teams now consider Stanton to be ahead of Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn, due in large part to great interviews with teams in Indy, and strong overall intangibles.

While no one doubts that Notre Dame coach Charlie Weis has prepared Quinn to play quarterback in a pro-style offense, there are questions about whether he possesses the leadership abilities to be successful in the NFL.

As we've previously heard, there also are questions about Quinn's ability to perform on a big stage, and some concerns about whether he wants to be a Hollywood type or whether he is committed to being the best football player he can be. Similar questions knocked Matt Leinart down to the tenth overall spot in the 2006 draft.

So don't be surprised if Stanton gets drafted after JaMarcus Russell of LSU, and prior to Quinn.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I've noticed over the years that PFT seems to enjoy dinging the top rated QB's for whatever reason...
 
Damn I wish I was earlier with my thoughts!

I was going to post how I 'thought' Stanton was a first rounder after his combine performance and measurables came out, and could see him as high as to Carolina (14) Jax (17) or some of the later teams: Chicago, Philly, Baltimore in round one...

1) Russell
2) Quinn -still-
3) Stanton (Gone by the mid second, IMO)
4) Edwards
5) Smith (Third rounder to Cleveland, maybe?)
 
Interesting, though I don't buy it... I don't think Quinn slips out of the top 8 if that... Be nice to trade down a few spots and get Quinn as well as a pick or three...

From PFT:

STANTON LEAPFROGGING QUINN?


One of the darlings of the scouting combine is Michigan State quarterback Drew Stanton. Word is that several teams now consider Stanton to be ahead of Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn, due in large part to great interviews with teams in Indy, and strong overall intangibles.

While no one doubts that Notre Dame coach Charlie Weis has prepared Quinn to play quarterback in a pro-style offense, there are questions about whether he possesses the leadership abilities to be successful in the NFL.

As we've previously heard, there also are questions about Quinn's ability to perform on a big stage, and some concerns about whether he wants to be a Hollywood type or whether he is committed to being the best football player he can be. Similar questions knocked Matt Leinart down to the tenth overall spot in the 2006 draft.

So don't be surprised if Stanton gets drafted after JaMarcus Russell of LSU, and prior to Quinn...
This is a stupid fucking comment. All I've been reading about is how Quinn has been working his ass of to the extreme to prepare for his workouts and for the NFL. He's determined to do everything he can to become the #1 pick overall.

Isn't that the definition of a guy who "is committed to being the best football player he can be?"

Leinart's going to be great. Quinn is going to be great.
 
This is a stupid fucking comment. All I've been reading about is how Quinn has been working his ass of to the extreme to prepare for his workouts and for the NFL. He's determined to do everything he can to become the #1 pick overall.

Isn't that the definition of a guy who "is committed to being the best football player he can be?"

Leinart's going to be great. Quinn is going to be great.
First it's all bullshit. I don't know what Quinn did to piss off people but all I see in his interviews is a guy who is dedicated, works out and wants to play and win. Let's not forget this guy is 6'3" 233...in most years scouts are calling him the prototypical QB...great size, very good to excellent arm, smart, played in a pro style offensive with a major college...*sigh*...until that bowl game Russell wasn't even on the radar now he's God? Fuck that. Lots of question marks in my mind about Ja...

And yes, we fucked up by not taking Matt Leinart over a safety. I think Leinart is going to make the Raiders sorry they passed on him at #7 :eek:...remember when we fucked up and forgot to draft Dan Marino?
 
Coming around to Quinn

Ever since HBoy pointed out that the Raiders new QB Coach "Flip" was on the Notre Dame Staff that recruited Quinn, My Al sensor has been going off. When Kiffin saw Quinn at USC (twice) Quinn threw for a combined 41 for 75 for 535 yards with 4td's and 1 Int. During those same games KK watched his QB's (Booty and Leinert) go 34 for 60 for 566 yards and 3 TD's and 4 INT's.
Now he brings in Flip, who he does not know, and Quinn is starting to slide.

The more I see and read about Quinn, he definitely puts in the work and is smart, dedicated and has good size and great strength. He reminds of a lead by example guy (Gannon anyone?).

If we can trade down six spots and get Quinn plus a buttload of additional draft choices (thats 1400 points of value) then I say do it.
 
First it's all bullshit. I don't know what Quinn did to piss off people but all I see in his interviews is a guy who is dedicated, works out and wants to play and win. Let's not forget this guy is 6'3" 233...in most years scouts are calling him the prototypical QB...great size, very good to excellent arm, smart, played in a pro style offensive with a major college...*sigh*...until that bowl game Russell wasn't even on the radar now he's God? Fuck that. Lots of question marks in my mind about Ja...

And yes, we fucked up by not taking Matt Leinart over a safety. I think Leinart is going to make the Raiders sorry they passed on him at #7 :eek:...remember when we fucked up and forgot to draft Dan Marino?

Quinn is a really good prospect just like Lienart was. I think Lienart would be way ahead of QUinn if they both were in the draft after thier senior years at the same time. Lienart just has a better college track record as far as a big gamer/leader IMHO. JR and Vince young both have that something special that could be a rare find and dangerous weapon in the league. I think JR has more of an upside than Young did as a prospect because he is a pocket passer and still can make plays on pure athletcism. But if Vince passes like he did in college and runs like he did last year...he might be a HOFer. If all four were in the draft how would they rate.

For Safety:
1.Leinart 2.Quinn 3. JR 4. Young

For upside
1. Young 2. JR 3. Quinn 4. Lienart

All of these guys have good and bad traits.
Who knows if Vince will ever be a pocket Qb who can take off, like what people expected of vick. JR could be the next great passer in the NFL. Huge, Giant arm etc, or a Ryan Leaf type player who's skills dont match his brain. Lienart could be the next Montana or a guy who cant make all the throws when the game is on the line. Quinn could become the next Carson Palmer or he could become a guy who has a knock for playing well vs bad teams and not showing up vs strong defense's. Im not sure where im going with this... please hold for bong hit....

Ok i guess im saying that any QB is Gamble (Duh), but if you use last year as an example then we should take JR because Young's upside worked out and he made ROY and the Pro-Bowl. Lienart was solid last season and i think Quinn will be a solid NFL QB. The question really is, should we gamble at QB #1 overall with a player who has skills to change the NFL? Or do we take another player who could be a gamechanger( CJ, AP). I think Quinn is a great player and a great prospect. I just dont think he is the kind of guy you take #1 overall. If we traded down he would be a really smart pick for us.

Do we wanna be smart and make some safe moves to assure our struggling franchise is headed in the right direction.
OR
Do we wanna gamble on a guy who might be able to take us back to the top on his skills alone.

Its a tough call. I love JR's upside more than I like the confidence i have the BQ will not bust. I think the time is now to get our future QB. Let him learn with our young coach and compete for a job late next season. The wildcard here is what Kiffin and AL think, if they believe in Walter than AP or CJ will look great in S&B for the next 7-14 years~
Sorry for the stoned rambling.
 
Do we wanna be smart and make some safe moves to assure our struggling franchise is headed in the right direction.
Robert Gallery

Mike Huff
Do we wanna gamble on a guy who might be able to take us back to the top on his skills alone.
When was the last time we did this? When have we taken a shot at an offensive guy in the first round who could come in at a major position of need and change the game for us? Probably the last time was Rickey Dudley in 1996, but he was a #9 pick, not a top-3.

QB?

RB?

WR?

One could argue the trade for Moss was such a move because it involved giving up the #7 overall. But Moss wasn't all that much of a gamble, was he? The guy was hot on the heels of Rice as far as stats. He was a proven gamebreaker.

I personally just don't believe Quinn is as much of a risk as everyone thinks. Any prolific college QB - and Quinn has been prolific - who has intelligence and works his ass off has a great shot at getting the job done at the next level.
 
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Robert Gallery

Mike Huff
Yeah, beautiful and we'll still wondering who is going to play QB for this team. :rolleyes:

I personally just don't believe Quinn is as much of a risk as everyone thinks. Any prolific college QB - and Quinn has been prolific - who has intelligence and works his ass off has a great shot at getting the job done at the next level.
The pressure of this #1 pick is enormous. I don't think Al Davis gives a shit about what the media thinks or the experts think but no matter, at some level, he worries about making a mistake...

The Russell jihad is in full swing. Almost every football expert has jumped on the bandwagon. Why? Over one bowl game? Or is it just his upside? You look at Russell and there are a lot more question marks than answers right now. Raw talent, questionable work ethic, physical conditioning...and more. Sure he could blow up and be the next Elway but it still is a huge risk. Quinn on the other hand is solid IMO...and because people are all stoked about Russel's upside Quinn is apparently dropping. So trading down just makes the most sense. We could still get a damn good prospect (Russell is a prospect just as much as Quinn) and hopefully get Lynch or some other stud player to complement our draft.

I know Russell can throw the ball 60 yards from his knees. Ever see that done in an NFL game? Personally I'm not worried about Quinn's ability to throw the 20 yard outs on a rope...and I wonder how many times it's necessary to throw the ball 60 yards in the air. Very over rated IMO. See Rich Gannon.
 
Yeah, beautiful and we'll still wondering who is going to play QB for this team. :rolleyes:

The pressure of this #1 pick is enormous. I don't think Al Davis gives a shit about what the media thinks or the experts think but no matter, at some level, he worries about making a mistake...

The Russell jihad is in full swing. Almost every football expert has jumped on the bandwagon. Why? Over one bowl game? Or is it just his upside? You look at Russell and there are a lot more question marks than answers right now. Raw talent, questionable work ethic, physical conditioning...and more. Sure he could blow up and be the next Elway but it still is a huge risk. Quinn on the other hand is solid IMO...and because people are all stoked about Russel's upside Quinn is apparently dropping. So trading down just makes the most sense. We could still get a damn good prospect (Russell is a prospect just as much as Quinn) and hopefully get Lynch or some other stud player to complement our draft.

I know Russell can throw the ball 60 yards from his knees. Ever see that done in an NFL game? Personally I'm not worried about Quinn's ability to throw the 20 yard outs on a rope...and I wonder how many times it's necessary to throw the ball 60 yards in the air. Very over rated IMO. See Rich Gannon.

You make some nice points Bones...I think Quinn is hiding something personally. I think the kids knee may be bothering hims still thus he elected not to participate at the combine, Kids physique looked amazing and he really has indicated how much he keeps in shape, studies film etc. I said a while back that JaMarcus was in it for the money and lacked the self motivation to be a gret player. JaMarcus at the number one pick I would not chance and I still say we have to go Adrian Peterson.
 


The Russell jihad is in full swing. Almost every football expert has jumped on the bandwagon. Why? Over one bowl game? Or is it just his upside?

This is a lttle unfair...


You look at Russell and there are a lot more question marks than answers right now. Raw talent, questionable work ethic, physical conditioning...and more.

I don't think anyone disputes this... There are legitimate questions, just like every other propect out there, but there also is a talent ceiling that needs to be weighed into the risk/reward factor IMO... I have yet to see the questionable work ethic/doesn't love the game as it relates to the football field conjecture substantiated to my satisfaction... Would I like to see him 10 pounds lighter? Yeah of course... but anyone that expects him to sport a 6 pack like Brady needs to understand that is genetically a little harder for an Endomorph bodytype than it is a Mesomorph... Marshall Faulk is a good example of a Endomorph that looked overweight and out of shape no matter how much work he put in... but yes, his long term weight is something that really needs to be discussed and evaluated during the interview process... If Kiffen and company don't get satisfactory answers and see a willingness to dive head first into a program designed by a nutritionalist, then they need to move on... Charles Barkley went from being a roly poly fat boy to being a solid athlete just by cutting out the typical collegiate late night pizza/taco/burger diet... I don't think Russell willl be Jerry Porter like astetically speaking, but he should be a comfortable 250 with some minor tweaks...


Quinn on the other hand is solid IMO...and because people are all stoked about Russel's upside Quinn is apparently dropping.

I find there are legitimate questions about BQ as well... I have the same question about him that I had about Eli Manning... Has he already plateaued as a prospect?... I didn't see a big jump of improvement made from his JR and Sr year.... I'm talking tangible improvement, not statistical because a QB is going to stat up within a Weis system... I love him when he's able to throw within the rhythm of the offense, but I find that he floats the ball a bit and his accuracy lessen when taken out of that bubble... Within the framework of a timing offense he is Tom Brady lite, taken out of it he is eeirly Joey Harrington like IMO... To the plus, I think the Kiffen system would be very Quinn friendly and condusive to success...

Personally, I don't think we could wrong with Russell at one, or Quinn in the three hole... myself I would be tempted to roll the dice on the upside of JaMarcus, but that doesn't mean I don't like Quinn...
 
You mean like you did on your previous post?
My previous post was meant to add yet one more comment to the mountain of comments I've already made regarding my feelings about Russell. I've laid out a boatload of arguments, and now I'm saying his big arm doesn't mean shit to me.

My post was part of the general conversation of the thread.

It was a response to Bones' talking point, showing that I agree with him 100%.

Your post was useless and shitty.

Great comparison.
 
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