Whither Brady Quinn?

[Crossbones]

OK it's time to talk about why Brady Quinn isn't the man and what has happened in the last two months to change most everybody's opinion of him.

Frankly until the bowl game against LSU Quinn was or had been the consensus number on pick in the upcoming drat (for the last two seasons). So the Notre Dame team that took the field that night was physically overmatched against a more talented LSU bunch...JaMarcus Russell looked like a man child in that game against a sub par ND defense. Is this the reason? Before that game Russell was getting only occasional blips on the radar screen but never in my recollection as the overall #1 pick.

So what's happened to Brady Quinn and why has he taken a nose dive. Mel Kiper has now dropped him to the nine spot in the first round going to Miami. Is Brady Matt Leinart reincarnated?

Quinn seems to have all the tools to play in the NFl and be very good. His arm is strong, he seems smart, has played in a pro style offense for 4 years and has been tutored by Charlie Weis a known QB coaching Guru. Is it because his team merely overachieved the last 2-3 years because of what some say is a pansy schedule? Is the JaMarcus Russell's arm strength binding the experts? Is JaMarcus really that much better of a prospect or is he more of a project with unbelievable physical skills and measureables?

Discuss?

 

[poptart]

In my mind Quinn is the 'safer' QB pick.

If Oakland is going to draft a QB, then I can't say I'd object to the idea of trading down and landing him.

Save us from paying #1 pick $$$, and give us more (or higher) later picks to work with.

 

[Raider Nation]

My questions on Quinn...



Can he be a player in any pro-style offense? It would seem his arm and mechanics are better suited for a West Coast Offense (i.e. Tampa Bay, Seattle, Minnesota, or Philly) more than a conventional offense.

Quinn struggled against elite competition in college. What happens we he faces elite competition in the pros every week?

How will he do away from Charlie Weiss? Seems those two are locked at the hip in all the reports I read and while I have no doubt Quinn will be ok as a pro, I just don't know if anybody in the NFL is going to tap into Quinn like Weiss did.



In terms of comparison to Russell, I think Quinn is perceived as more of a finished product with limited upside. His arm is good, he makes good reads, has good footwork, and is intelligent. But he doesn't have that "it" factor that has people drooling over Russell. Russell has a better arm, better record against top competition, played in the toughest conference in college football, throws better on the run, and has a much better throwing motion than Quinn. Russell gets the ball out so much faster than Quinn right now. Russell's more of a project in the sense that it will most likely take him longer to absorb an NFL playbook. He also tends to rely a little too much on his physical ability and has a tendency to play outside the framework of the called play. Sometimes that works, sometimes it doesn't.

The perception right now is Quinn is a good to very good QB coming out of college with limited upside while Russell is a good to very good QB coming out of college with unlimited potential.

The best thing that could happen to Brady Quinn is he gets drafted by Gruden and the Bucs. It's the perfect system for him, they already have the ground game, solid receivers, and a solid defense. And sitting behind Simms for a year, if necessary, would allow him to hit the ground running in '08.

 

[Seraph24]

Is Brady Matt Leinart reincarnated?

can't hold his jock strap.
Brady is a stats guy on a team that typically plays cream puffs for 60-80 percent of their schedule. when you actually see him play everybody has their own opinion. Mines is that he isn't as good as advertised. Either way the assessment gets iffy. It depends on what type of value do you put on his performances.

Is he the guy who helped with the comeback against michigan state or the guy who played who got in a position to need a large comeback? was him or was it michigan state(who became notorious for choking like that)?

Is he the guy who goes ape shit on the smaller schools and tries his ass off against bigger schools in a losing effort typically? Or the guy who gets eaten alive against U of M and LSU's defenses?

The answer is in the middle IMO. Which still isnt worth a top 5 pick. Not saying he wont be a top five pick, But Joe Thomas, AP, JR, Calvin Johnson all get my attention before him.

The best thing that could happen to Brady Quinn is he gets drafted by Gruden and the Bucs. It's the perfect system for him, they already have the ground game, solid receivers, and a solid defense. And sitting behind Simms for a year, if necessary, would allow him to hit the ground running in '08.

yep, i totally agree. I honestly thought Matt Leinart found the right fit in arizona, though some wont agree. i think Quinn will be a good possession qb, i think matt will be a great one. Can't say i see that as what we need.

 

[poptart]

The perception right now is Quinn is a good to very good QB coming out of college with limited upside while Russell is a good to very good QB coming out of college with unlimited potential,

That's it in a nutshell.

Do you have the balls to pay up for a #1 overall QB who might fufill that 'unlimited potential' that everyone is jizzin' over .... ?

When all is said and done I think the idea of big-armed Russell slingin' the ball all over the yard will be Al's personal little blue pill, and he'll pull the trigger and land the big kid.

Not sayin' I necessarily agree or disagree.
Just sayin' that is what I see happening.

 

[Raider Nation]

When all is said and done I think the idea of big-armed Russell slingin' the ball all over the yard will be Al's personal little blue pill, and he'll pull the trigger and land the big kid.

I agree, I think it's the way Al-Kiffen goes and then we are subjected to all sorts of discussion from Al-Kiffen that Russell is the best QB prospect since Elway. I happen to disagree with that, but you can bet if Russell's the choice they are going to whip the fanbase into a frenzy and hype the kid from the moment he steps up to the podium.

 

[Chris_77]

Brady is just suffering from the inevitable backlash that results from over-exposure. Everyone would be all over him as a "sleeper" ala' Cutler or Alex Smith had he not been the pre-season Heisman favorite and didn't play for Notre Dame.

 

[hawaiianboy]

The best thing that could happen to Brady Quinn is he gets drafted by Gruden and the Bucs. It's the perfect system for him, they already have the ground game, solid receivers, and a solid defense. And sitting behind Simms for a year, if necessary, would allow him to hit the ground running in '08.

I agree with this... My assesment of Saint Quinn hasn't changed much.... When he's allowed to get the ball out quickly in a 1-2-3 rhythm, he's an above average QB prospect...When taken out of that rhythm and forced to move down his progression scale, he needs some work... I don't see him as a guy capable of making something out of nothing ala Jamarcus, but I believe he's a guy that is capable of executing an offense tailored to his skillsets to perfection...


The thing that sours me the most is his apologist fan base... "his receivers get no seperation", "his O-line is subpar", "the sun was in his eyes" blah blah blah... Just admit he's had some bad games at crucial times and move on already....

 

[Limee]

I think Quinn is suffering in comparison because of the last game played and the fact that there isn't any one thing about him to get really excited about. He doesn't have a huge signature win (nearly did against USC) and he obviously doesn't have the physical skills to compare to Russell. That leaves it as looking that he is a well coached QB with solid fundamentals and a good footballing brain which just isn't as sexy as a QB with the amazing arm and release that Russell has. It will be interesting to see how the combine and pro days go with these two. I think it could be back to being closer at the top, but who knows.

 

[Seraph24]

"the sun was in his eyes"

..............

 

[BigPoppaPump]

I agree with the peeps above. You need to throw away a lot of BQ's games against the creampuffs. When he faced good comp, he did bad. When the lights were on, he played bad. That is just not a confidence builder imo.

As for the MSU game, I will just say....MSU was not that good a team. I do not give him a ton of cred for the win. The two games that really stand out to me are MU and LSU. Michigan was exposed as having a not so solid secondary and Quinn did not exploit that like USC did. Makes you wonder...at least it makes me wonder.

 

[007]

I get a chuckle out of people playing the 'throw out BQ's cream puff schedule' card...

Plenty of articles have been posted showing BQ's strength of schedule was comparable with OSU's...He played solid teams like PSU, Michigan, USC, MSU, Purdue, Stanford etc all throughout his career.

The guy played big, successful games throughout his career against Michigan, MSU, PSU, USC etc.

Football is a TEAM sport and he shoulders too much of the blame for playing on an overrated ND squad with a piss poor defense.

Did anyone really think ND was goingt to come within 3 scores of LSU in the bowl game?

If your record in bowl games and against big time competition mattered, Jay Cutler would have fucking went undrafted. He got shit kicked week in week out by tough teams...

It gets to the point around draft time, when people start to over analyze and nit pick on prospects, which is how Leinart dropped last year, and Quinn might do the same this year.

If you read up on it though, there is a reason solid organizations like Carolina, Jacksonville and Miami are rumored to have a hard on for the guy: He's a GOOD PROSPECT.

 

[R4Life]

The debate continues

I remember reading this article the day it was posted at si.com.
I posted it here because it was written before the Sugar Bowl.
I do not want to put our #1 hopes on BQ. I believe he is now about as good as he is going to be. He's been coached well and has not improved since his Junior year. Russell has shown steady improvement and I believe he will continue to do so. So yeah, I agree - Higher ceiling on Russell.


Who's No. 1?
The battle begins: Brady Quinn vs. JaMarcus Russell

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/ncaa/01/03/quinn.russell/?cnn=yes

As the nation tunes in to the Sugar Bowl tonight, NFL scouts will be watching closely as well. While Notre Dame and LSU duke it out, the quarterbacks of each team will be auditioning in what could be a hotly contested battle to see who will become the No. 1 pick in April's NFL draft.

With the quarterback-starved Oakland Raiders holding the first pick, a lot of people feel Notre Dame's Brady Quinn will be wearing the silver and black next season. But that sentiment may be a bit premature.

There are several people in the scouting community who feel that LSU junior JaMarcus Russell has the best NFL potential of any quarterback in the nation. In their minds it is Russell, not Quinn, who should be the first quarterback selected, if Russell leaves school early, as expected.

Much was expected from Quinn in his final season in South Bend. The strong-armed pocket passer displayed signs of brilliance as a junior in '05 and possessed all the tools in Charlie Weis' NFL system to be labeled as a "franchise quarterback." But Quinn did not deliver in his senior year, according to some NFL scouts. Inconsistent play through much of the season -- which included poor decision making, less-than-desirable accuracy and the inability to win big games -- has diminished his value.

Russell, on the other hand, had a career season, showing improvement in all aspects of his game. He completed 68.5 percent of his throws and his touchdown passes and passing yards both increased. He also decreased the number of interceptions thrown and sacks taken. Most impressively, Russell showed remarkable poise and good decision-making compared to previous seasons. He slowly morphed from an athlete and thrower into a complete passer. Many in the scouting community feel Russell has the strongest arm in the nation, as well as tremendous size. He's already drawing comparisons to Daunte Culpepper because of his similar physical stature and style of play.

So who will be the first quarterback selected in April's draft, Quinn or Russell?

While the Sugar Bowl will end around midnight tonight, the speculation about who will be the No. 1 pick will go on for months.

 

[RHC]

I think Quinn is suffering in comparison because of the last game played and the fact that there isn't any one thing about him to get really excited about.

37 passing TDs. 2 rushing TDs. 3400 yds. Only 7 INTs. 63%. 148 rating.

I'm pretty fucking excited.

As far as him tanking against elite teams, the dude threw for 274 yds, 3 TDs, 0 INTs and a 122 rating against USC. He also rushed for 74 yards. USC wound up ranked #4.

Against Michigan Quinn was playing catch-up all game. His defense let him down big-time. Mike hart hung 124 rushing yds on them. Manningham had 137 receiving yds and 3 TDs.

Quinn had to make something happen. As a team ND had 4 fucking rushing yards for the entire game. And he still wound up with a 99 rating.

He had a bad game against LSU.

What the fuck do you want from the guy?

Go take a look at Russell's game vs. Florida. He didn't exacty light it up against Auburn either.

And back in 2005, when Quinn was establishing himself as one of the best QBs in the game, Russell was eating shit against a lot of teams.

 

[007]

He also had 2 INT tips returned for TD against Michigan.

We'd be LUCKY to have a QB like Quinn or J-Russ on our team. They both have big time talent and will likely be successes in the big show, IMO.

 

[RHC]

I remember reading this article the day it was posted at si.com.
I posted it here because it was written before the Sugar Bowl.
I do not want to put our #1 hopes on BQ. I believe he is now about as good as he is going to be. He's been coached well and has not improved since his Junior year. Russell has shown steady improvement and I believe he will continue to do so. So yeah, I agree - Higher ceiling on Russell.


Who's No. 1?
The battle begins: Brady Quinn vs. JaMarcus Russell

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/football/ncaa/01/03/quinn.russell/?cnn=yes

As the nation tunes in to the Sugar Bowl tonight, NFL scouts will be watching closely as well. While Notre Dame and LSU duke it out, the quarterbacks of each team will be auditioning in what could be a hotly contested battle to see who will become the No. 1 pick in April's NFL draft.

With the quarterback-starved Oakland Raiders holding the first pick, a lot of people feel Notre Dame's Brady Quinn will be wearing the silver and black next season. But that sentiment may be a bit premature.

There are several people in the scouting community who feel that LSU junior JaMarcus Russell has the best NFL potential of any quarterback in the nation. In their minds it is Russell, not Quinn, who should be the first quarterback selected, if Russell leaves school early, as expected.

Much was expected from Quinn in his final season in South Bend. The strong-armed pocket passer displayed signs of brilliance as a junior in '05 and possessed all the tools in Charlie Weis' NFL system to be labeled as a "franchise quarterback." But Quinn did not deliver in his senior year, according to some NFL scouts.

I'm confused. How do questionable accuracy and poor decision-making result in 37 TDs and only 7 INTs, along with a 147 rating?

Seems like a blatant contradiction to me.

 

[donovan]

The thing that sours me the most is his apologist fan base... "his receivers get no seperation", "his O-line is subpar", "the sun was in his eyes" blah blah blah... Just admit he's had some bad games at crucial times and move on already....

Like all that shit will always be fine in the league...

 

[Ghost To The Post]

Absolutely Donovan...I can't guarantee that the sun will always be in his eyes...but the other two are locks if he comes to Oakland!!

 

[Raider Nation]

37 passing TDs. 2 rushing TDs. 3400 yds. Only 7 INTs. 63%. 148 rating.

I'm pretty fucking excited.

As far as him tanking against elite teams, the dude threw for 274 yds, 3 TDs, 0 INTs and a 122 rating against USC. He also rushed for 74 yards. USC wound up ranked #4.

Against Michigan Quinn was playing catch-up all game. His defense let him down big-time. Mike hart hung 124 rushing yds on them. Manningham had 137 receiving yds and 3 TDs.

Quinn had to make something happen. As a team ND had 4 fucking rushing yards for the entire game. And he still wound up with a 99 rating.

He had a bad game against LSU.

What the fuck do you want from the guy?

Go take a look at Russell's game vs. Florida. He didn't exacty light it up against Auburn either.

And back in 2005, when Quinn was establishing himself as one of the best QBs in the game, Russell was eating shit against a lot of teams.

Very true that Russell's '05 wasn't up to par with Quinn's. But, comparitvely speaking, Russell progressed from '05 to '06 while Quinn was widely considered to have either plateued or, according to some, regressed. People really expected Quinn to explode this year (see Heisman hype) but it didn't happen.

I look at Quinn's stats and they're fine. People can debate them all day and discuss his performance against Army, Air Force, USC, or Michigan for all I care. When I watch Quinn and Russell in games and then compare notes I see Russell with a superior arm, superior release, and superior leadership. I even give Russell the edge when it comes to progressing through his reads. If you ask me, there's a real big difference between how the ball comes out with Russell and how the ball comes out with Quinn. The ball fires out for Russell much like Cutler, lots of zip. Quinn's ball comes out with less force and it can get him in trouble on deep outs.

 

[BigTron]

The fact that people say ND has no talent makes me laugh. We are talking about ND right? Last time i checked they had some recruiting power. Jeff Smardijaza or what ever would have been a first round WR. Their other Wr is a third round prospect and well as thier RB and LT that sounds pretty talented for a college offense who plays Army etc... Im not saying ND was the best team in college football but saying its his teams fault is a cop out. Michigan absolutley crumbled Quinn and made him look like Aaron Brooks. I liked Quinn until I saw that game and I realized he cant make special plays and he is just a solid system QB. When pressured he looks frantic and in the NFL that spells turnover, no poise under pressure. I wont compare him to JR because they are different QB's. I think Quinn could be a pro-bowler but i dont ever see him being a superstar in the NFL. Between him and Weiss id say that ND was more of a dissapointment then an un-talented team. Besides whats he going to do with our offense? BQuinn would be a good pick if we could trade down and get another 1st next year and a 2nd this year. I think the guy will be a decent QB in the league but not worth the #1 overall by any means. If Boise can beat Oklahoma than ND should be able to beat somebody good if their QB worth a top 5 pick. I cant believe people bring up the Michigan State game, they fucking suck ass. Air force, Army.... as if A.Walter couldnt light those teams up.