Ray Rice has declared

[Jack's sore libido]

Man, knowing that there should be a very good RB available to the Raiders at the top of the second round, I'm even more opposed to taking McFadden now.

 

[Crow]

Everything I've heard/read has him possibly available in Rd3. Some think Rutgers wore down the tread on his tires a bit.

Won't happen, but I'd pounce all over him if he's there in Rd4, or maybe even do a Mario Henderson trade type thing to grab him in Rd3.

If, by some freak chance, we beef up our DL in Rd1 and with some legit FAs (not the bargain bin rejects some have talked about), I'd be really intrigued with the idea of trading up from Rd2 for Jonathan Stewart. If he drops like Steven Jackson did (did anyone ever get a clear understanding of why Jackson fell so far?), I'd be pretty happy to see us jump into the 20s to catch him.

5'11, 230, plenty fast, plenty strong...

Put him in this scheme and I think he'd be a brute.

 

[Jack's sore libido]

(did anyone ever get a clear understanding of why Jackson fell so far?),

It was partly because teams just didn't need running backs that year, and partly because his YPC his junior year at Oregon State was only 4.4, which is on the low end for college RBs, particularly from the Pac.

 

[Jack's sore libido]

I don't see how Ray Rice could make it out of Round 2. I know it's different years and all, but this year would have to be a helluva lot deeper than last year to merit Rice going lower than former teammate Brian Leonard.

 

[007]

I don't see how Ray Rice could make it out of Round 2. I know it's different years and all, but this year would have to be a helluva lot deeper than last year to merit Rice going lower than former teammate Brian Leonard.

Three reasons Rice doesnt go round 2, IMO

1) He had what? 1000 carries in 3 seasons? Tread life does become a factor, especially on a little back like Raymell...

2) Like I mentioned before, I can't think of many 5-9 200 pound backs that go in the first couple rounds...I just did a quick draft search and came up with:

-Reggie Bush- And Raymell aint no Reggie

-MJD- And even he had 20 pounds and legs like tree trunks

-JJ Arrington- Who?

3) Have you seen the people at RB this draft? Absolutely insane...

McFadden
Mendenhall
Stewart
Kevin Smith
Jones
Charles
Hart
Johnson
Forte
Forsett
Patrick
Little
Torain

The list goes on and on...

Now, I could see him going ahead of half of those guys, but is that gonna push him into the top 50-60 picks? I doubt it.

 

[Jack's sore libido]

Three reasons Rice doesnt go round 2, IMO

1) He had what? 1000 carries in 3 seasons? Tread life does become a factor, especially on a little back like Raymell...

Ron Dayne says hi.

So does Ricky Williams.

And Emmitt Smith

2) Like I mentioned before, I can't think of many 5-9 200 pound backs that go in the first couple rounds...I just did a quick draft search and came up with:

-Reggie Bush- And Raymell aint no Reggie

-MJD- And even he had 20 pounds and legs like tree trunks

-JJ Arrington- Who?[/quote]

Don't forget Tiki Barber, Warrick Dunn, Emmitt Smith ...

3) Have you seen the people at RB this draft? Absolutely insane...

McFadden
Mendenhall
Stewart
Kevin Smith
Jones
Charles
Hart
Johnson
Forte
Forsett
Patrick
Little
Torain

I see 2 or 3 that should go ahead of Rice. Maybe 4.

Still, that's all the more reason to take a DL at 1.3 or 1.4 and wait until the second, or even third round, for a RB.

 

[Raider Bill]

I don't see how you can go RB round 1.

There's too much other shit wrong.

Part of the appeal of this stretch and cut style of play is a blue chip RB isn't required

 

[Crossbones]

I don't see how you can go RB round 1.

There's too much other shit wrong.

Part of the appeal of this stretch and cut style of play is a blue chip RB isn't required

I have to admit I'm warming to the idea of DMC. Not because there aren't other things wrong -- clearly there arre a lot of things wrong -- -but because I'm scared to death whoever we pick will not be an immediate impact player. I guess you can't draft scared but after these last 4 years I'm jsut flat gun shy!

McFadden seems to be the most likely not to bust.

I'm always in the trade down camp but migfht as well forget about that.

 

[Crow]

I think you have to maintain McFadden's one real red flag in this conversation: NFL teams don't run the Wild Hog.

Am I saying he can't be a stud in a traditional ground game? Of course not. But I certainly can't fault anyone for wondering.

McFadden is a homerun hitter. In this scheme, we're talking about a young Clinton Portis or a superior version of Jerious Norwood. I'm not going to complain if we draft the guy. BUT, there are going to be some great fits for this scheme later on with 4.4 speed or better later on. 007 listed a few of them.

Plus, as Denver continues to prove, you can pull a really good back out of your ass if you run this scheme well.

Ron Dayne says hi.

So does Ricky Williams.

And Emmitt Smith

2 busts, 1 HoFer.

Not really sure that helps Ray very much.

Still, that's all the more reason to take a DL at 1.3 or 1.4 and wait until the second, or even third round, for a RB.

I just hope we work our way back into the high-to-mid-3rd. That Henderson thing is killing me right now.

 

[Jack's sore libido]

2 busts, 1 HoFer.

Not really sure that helps Ray very much.

I'm speaking merely to precedent.

I doubt very much anyone is going to care about the number of carries Rice has had. They haven't cared in the past.

 

[Crow]

I think it may depend on where they rank him. If a team has him grading out the same as a guy with half as many carries...

 

[007]

Good stuff in this thread, IMO.

Jack: Although it doesnt rank high up there (Amount of carries, workload etc.) combining it with his lack of size, measurables and the amount of other potential studs could drop him on many boards.

Not saying I dont want him, but Im actually thinking he might be there in round 3-4 for us...Facilitating the drafting of OL or DL in round two.

 

[Byron2112]

(Amount of carries, workload etc.) combining it with his lack of size, measurables and the amount of other potential studs could drop him on many boards.

These are exactly the things the "draft guy" on ESPN(no, not the hairmaster) was saying about him, and why he'd be a 2nd, 3rd rounder... no one would invest bank in a small dude with alotta wear on his treads... said he had 900+ carries.

Obviously he doesn't have the freakishly massive thighs Jones-Drew has(not many dudes at any size are built like that), but I thought the guy looked pretty stumpy overall for a small guy, so I dunno just how negative the real effect of his size will be.... for instance, his lower body looked thicker than Nappy too me.

 

[007]

Heh thats funny he said the same stuff.

I like Rice, so don't get me wrong, but I just don't see a lot of little 200 pounders with damn near 1000 carries going early...

The dude has a solid frame, but he's a lot closer to Arrington than he is to MJD.

If he's there in round 3 or 4 and we make a move, halleluyah. Just not in round two at the expense of missing out on an OT or DL.

 

[Jack's sore libido]

Hey, I'm all for getting Rice in the 3rd or 4th round. Just sayin, if Brian Leonard went in the second round, this would have to be an awfully deep draft for Rice to drop to the 3rd.

 

[Crow]

Not really sure what Leonard, or anyone from a past draft, has to do with Rice's slotting this year.

 

[007]

Not really sure what Leonard, or anyone from a past draft, has to do with Rice's slotting this year.

C'mon you have to go and play the antagonist?

Leonard was a Rutgers guy, Rice is a Rutgers guy, Rice is the better back and did worlds better in the same system, yet will go later in the draft...

Don't tell me you didnt get his post.

 

[Crow]

Who's being an antagonist? They're two different backs in two different drafts. Where one gets drafted compared to the other really has nothing to do with anything.

Now, had they both come out the same year, there'd actually be some relevance to the comparison.

What exactly is the issue?

 

[hawaiianboy]

Ron Dayne says hi.

So does Ricky Williams.

And Emmitt Smith

Ladainian Tomlinson is the guy that pops to mind when this subject is brought up... He was hitting the Pre-combine trifecta with the draft analysists: Too much thread (almost 400 carries his SR year), product of the system (option offense) and lower level conference (WAC)... Then he blew up at the combine and you know...

The too much carry angle is not a real big concern for me personally unless the guy has a Larry Czonka running style... The way I figure it, good backs at the college level aren't putting up the lofty 6, 7, 8 ypc averages by taking a whole lot of first level hits...

If, by some freak chance, we beef up our DL in Rd1 and with some legit FAs (not the bargain bin rejects some have talked about), I'd be really intrigued with the idea of trading up from Rd2 for Jonathan Stewart. If he drops like Steven Jackson did (did anyone ever get a clear understanding of why Jackson fell so far?), I'd be pretty happy to see us jump into the 20s to catch him.

5'11, 230, plenty fast, plenty strong...

Put him in this scheme and I think he'd be a brute.

Now you're lifting my wallet: http://www.afcwestforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=38713&highlight=jonathan#post38713
Note the date

 

[Crow]

Bah. You owed me that one.