Offensive Line Play

Stanny

Stanny

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2006
Messages
2,544
Reaction score
1,613
Just thought this would be a good subject to bring up for the moment with the way our "run" game has produced all year and the fact that the year is closing and before you know it the draft will be here. Here's some of my thoughts, please chime in.

Start with Gallery and I'll probably be in the minority here, as a few weeks back most of you said its official, he's a bust.

Robert Gallery

I've went back over the film for the past two weeks as well as checked a few of the other games out via TIVO. This guy is NIGHT and DAY from years past. He is starting to show decent foot work and balance and not sure if you guys have noticed he has developed a nice "punch" to the chest during pass pro. The guy has been doing extremely well in the run dept and hustles his ass off. he manhandled Denver's line and who ever they threw at him. You look on just about every play, that guy will engage, finish and then hustle down field. Something I found that I don't like is, he tends to slide to Sims side to provide help and at times a guy can slip his gap and if the RB is not there could pose a problem. I personally think its because he doesn't trust Sims to go one on one and their communication sucks. The other issue is his mental lapse, false start, stupid penalties at crucial times. Between him and Sims they can kill a drive quickly. But those can be fixed...It's just nice to see that the physical part of the game by sustaining his blocks and getting good push, is coming along nicely.

Sims

Very slow first step and if you notice ends are lining up further and wider each week because they can still get around him lined up out that far. He handled Jared Allen because Gallery, Miller and the RB's helped out quite a bit. His run blocking is just ok at this point and doesn't it look like the dude is "winded" all the time? The guy is pretty strong, but slow a foot. Mental break downs by this guy has been atrocious. His name is called ever game for a false start at least once and he's good for a hold and a sack a game. Too much money with no return. 2008 he should be shown the door.

Newberry

Great leader, tough guy mentality. His snaps suck ass and I have not been impressed with this guy at all. At one point, I thought Grove was playing better and that's crazy. His knees have to be hurting him because I just don't see the push. He looks like Grove has in years past and I am surprised teams haven't blitz more up the gut. He's not bad in pass protection as his upper body is as strong as an ox, but you watch the first step. He gets pushed back just about every time but with his strength he can recoup. I think we got a year out of him, but I wouldn't mind getting some more youth/strength and stability at the Center position. Thanks for the one year.

Coop Carlisle

Great run blocker and a good head on his shoulders..not too many times have you heard his name get called for a dumb penalty. He doesn't have the strength in my eyes and relies all on being proficient and knowing his assignments. Nothing wrong with that, but at times he can be mauled and pushed around. He's solid but nothing special...really can't complain about the guy all that much. He's been a great addition.

McFugly

This guy has gotten better each week. Say what you want, I think HB nailed it at the start of the year that this guy would be best suited at the tackle spot manning the right side. His footwork has gotten extremely better and this fucker is STRONG. His feet still get him into trouble, but at least you now can see he has a right and a left foot and not two left feet. Look at what happens when he gets his hands on the defender, he fucking can just play with him like a sock. Can still play on his back feet and not the balls, but balance is much better and his run blocking has been looking great. Kid has a spot on this team for sure.



For 2008 I would look to get a LT and upgrade at Center. Carlisle is serviceable and I think Gallery will only get better at the guard position come 2008. Sims needs to go along with Newbs. Hopefully Mario can grow up and man the LT spot, Gallery at LG, Coop at RG with McFug at RT. Who do you plug into the Center spot? Would be nice to land a: Flozell Adams, Max Starks or Travelle Wharton at LT....Maybe Jake Scott or Chris Kemoeatu to upgrade the RG spot. I still say our two main concerns will be LT and Center. Does Grove have a spot? Can Mario start? What happens with Cornell Green? Is Morris just a backup or could he start at Center?
 
Nails Stanny! Great stuff.

We've still got to see McQuistan up against a great end. Tamba Hali is good, and Engleberger isn't as good. So it's right that he improved. Now comes Kampman. Let's see how well he does. I'm looking forward to the matchup. Let's see what the kid has got.
 
Good post. I do however feel like we will bring back Simms unless we find a replacement. We have a ton of cap room and he has played well enough to not being a glaring hole IMO. His penalties make me wanna throw up. If Mario Henderson is the future we might see naother year of Simms. We need to draft a C. Or sign one thru FA. Getting JaMarcus 1 center for his whole stay in Oakland would be a great move.
 
Stanny said:
Robert Gallery

I've went back over the film for the past two weeks as well as checked a few of the other games out via TIVO. This guy is NIGHT and DAY from years past. He is starting to show decent foot work and balance and not sure if you guys have noticed he has developed a nice "punch" to the chest during pass pro. The guy has been doing extremely well in the run dept and hustles his ass off. he manhandled Denver's line and who ever they threw at him. You look on just about every play, that guy will engage, finish and then hustle down field. Something I found that I don't like is, he tends to slide to Sims side to provide help and at times a guy can slip his gap and if the RB is not there could pose a problem. I personally think its because he doesn't trust Sims to go one on one and their communication sucks. The other issue is his mental lapse, false start, stupid penalties at crucial times. Between him and Sims they can kill a drive quickly. But those can be fixed...It's just nice to see that the physical part of the game by sustaining his blocks and getting good push, is coming along nicely.
Click to expand...
Well, first and foremost...man. I gotta get Tivo.

I haven't keyed in on individual linemen much of late, but one thing I have noticed is Gallery not spending quite as much time on his back side or eating turf. All things considered, I can forgive a lot of the mental mistakes. It's his physical failures that drive me nuts. Dude's too large to get pushed around the way he has. That said, I believe you're right in that he's really starting to settle in. He's a guard now. The merry-go-round is over. As is the long and painful search for a competent O-line coach. Bernard did us a huge favor cutting Cable loose. With those two things stabilized, I really believe Big Rob can get his career back on track. Maybe not the all pro we had hoped for, but I can settle for just being damn good and damn consistent.

Sims

Very slow first step and if you notice ends are lining up further and wider each week because they can still get around him lined up out that far. He handled Jared Allen because Gallery, Miller and the RB's helped out quite a bit. His run blocking is just ok at this point and doesn't it look like the dude is "winded" all the time? The guy is pretty strong, but slow a foot. Mental break downs by this guy has been atrocious. His name is called ever game for a false start at least once and he's good for a hold and a sack a game. Too much money with no return. 2008 he should be shown the door.
Click to expand...
Again, I haven't really focused on any one guy. But I though Sims had performed pretty well in these last two games. The false starts prior to that were insanely maddening. I'm certainly not opposed to upgrading here, but I'd be wary of just outright dumping him. Is Henderson going to be any better? Early indication would seem to say no. Do we really want to drop a day 1 pick on another tackle, especially considering how badly our D-line needs to be revamped?

I think Sims continues to be what he's always been: Solid, sometimes spectacular, often frustrating, but usually reliable. I may be alone here, but I'd just as soon hold on to a guy who, for all his mental mistakes, doesn't exactly suck.


Newberry

Great leader, tough guy mentality. His snaps suck ass and I have not been impressed with this guy at all. At one point, I thought Grove was playing better and that's crazy. His knees have to be hurting him because I just don't see the push. He looks like Grove has in years past and I am surprised teams haven't blitz more up the gut. He's not bad in pass protection as his upper body is as strong as an ox, but you watch the first step. He gets pushed back just about every time but with his strength he can recoup. I think we got a year out of him, but I wouldn't mind getting some more youth/strength and stability at the Center position. Thanks for the one year.
Click to expand...
I haven't noticed him playing that poorly. The Grove comparison is kinda hurtful and I think you should take that back.

Seriously, though. He's given us a year of stability in a transition period for our OL. Mission accomplished, I think. Now, I think we need to be on the lookout for a big, nasty, mauling, yet athletic guard to convert to center. I'm clueless when it comes to this year's class of interior OLs, so I don't know if that guy exists. But I'm all about looking for him. Grove...wow. Well, we drafted Adam Treu pretty high as well. Maybe that's Jake's destiny, to be the new Treu. If only he could pass protect as well as Adam did.


Coop Carlisle

Great run blocker and a good head on his shoulders..not too many times have you heard his name get called for a dumb penalty. He doesn't have the strength in my eyes and relies all on being proficient and knowing his assignments. Nothing wrong with that, but at times he can be mauled and pushed around. He's solid but nothing special...really can't complain about the guy all that much. He's been a great addition.
Click to expand...
Agreed. For all the Bronco fans saying that we'd love him on running plays and curse him as a pass protector, I can't complain about the guy at all. I think he'll be a fixture for at least a couple more years.


McFugly

This guy has gotten better each week. Say what you want, I think HB nailed it at the start of the year that this guy would be best suited at the tackle spot manning the right side. His footwork has gotten extremely better and this fucker is STRONG. His feet still get him into trouble, but at least you now can see he has a right and a left foot and not two left feet. Look at what happens when he gets his hands on the defender, he fucking can just play with him like a sock. Can still play on his back feet and not the balls, but balance is much better and his run blocking has been looking great. Kid has a spot on this team for sure.
Click to expand...
He had me praying for Cornell Green's speedy recovery for a week or two. But he seems to be developing into the guy we all hoped he could be. Strong, nasty player with some upside left to lookforward to. I'm not sold yet, but I'm also not betting against him at this point. I'm a fan, and I think Young Hugg is as well.


For 2008 I would look to get a LT and upgrade at Center. Carlisle is serviceable and I think Gallery will only get better at the guard position come 2008. Sims needs to go along with Newbs. Hopefully Mario can grow up and man the LT spot, Gallery at LG, Coop at RG with McFug at RT. Who do you plug into the Center spot? Would be nice to land a: Flozell Adams, Max Starks or Travelle Wharton at LT....Maybe Jake Scott or Chris Kemoeatu to upgrade the RG spot. I still say our two main concerns will be LT and Center. Does Grove have a spot? Can Mario start? What happens with Cornell Green? Is Morris just a backup or could he start at Center?
Click to expand...

I'm not even prepared to pencil Henderson in as a 2nd string tackle. I've never been a believer in Chris Morris, though he wouldn't be the first player to make me sing his school's fight song. I think free agency is where we need to do most of our OL shopping. Give Cable another year with Henderson to decide if we made a mistake taking a chance on him. Definitely add a couple guys on Day 2 and in undrafted FA.

Any way you slice it, we're on to something. It's something good. We just need to keep adding to it until we get it right.

Rep for the write up, bro. Good stuff.
 
Last edited:
Stanny said:
For 2008 I would look to get a LT and upgrade at Center. Carlisle is serviceable and I think Gallery will only get better at the guard position come 2008. Sims needs to go along with Newbs. Hopefully Mario can grow up and man the LT spot, Gallery at LG, Coop at RG with McFug at RT. Who do you plug into the Center spot? Would be nice to land a: Flozell Adams, Max Starks or Travelle Wharton at LT....Maybe Jake Scott or Chris Kemoeatu to upgrade the RG spot. I still say our two main concerns will be LT and Center. Does Grove have a spot? Can Mario start? What happens with Cornell Green? Is Morris just a backup or could he start at Center?
Click to expand...

We might be able to squeeze another year out of Newberry, who's done a decent job this season, but center is going to be as critical a position on the OL as is LT protecting our very big investment next year. I wouldn't be adverse to drafting a center first day, someone like Mike Pollak from ASU who'd be the perfect type of center for the ZBS we run. Maybe we'll get it right this time:p

As far as LT, our options are pretty much limited in FA. I don't want any part of Max Starks for what he'd command on the open market next season. We either draft a Sam Baker or hope Mario Henderson develops into that guy that Cable obviously saw something in, and that's a big "if" right now.
 
I wonder if Faneca could play center?

A smart, hardworking guy like that would do good leading... could probably get a few good seasons outta him in the pivot.
 
I'd certainly entertain that idea. I wonder if he would.
 
It would be absolutely HUGE if McQuistan could lock down that RT spot over the next four games to the point that we could pencil him in as the '08 and beyond starter... More so if Cable feels that Mario Henderson is the future at LT, even if he needs to spend another season working behind Sims...

It would be really nice to be able to use the draft pick or free agency loot most of us have earmarked for an OT on other positions of need...

I'd be down with using our 2nd round pick on Alex Mack if he declares early... He already knows the scheme and he's been dominant pretty much every time I've seen Cal this year... He looks like he could be a day one starter at center...
 
Good thread Stanny.

I agree with your basic assesment that LT & C are the biggest immediate needs.

Sims' better days waived bye-bye 3 years ago. Unlike most, I appreciate all his efforts over the years and for a time, he was our best OL. I think he deserves better from Raider Nation, but I do agree that an upgrade is diserable. Hopefully Henderson is that guy, but only time will tell.

If Gallery & McQuistan can lock down LG & RT, it will afford us much more flexibility.

I agree that Newberry is probably one & done in Oakland, though I admire the effort and influence he's seemed to have had on this line. Grove is simply not the answer and I don't think he offers much as an OG either. Straight up Bust. I think Chris Morris has more value to this team.

I'll challenge you slightly on Cooper Carlise. I wouldn't classify him as "great" in the run game due to his mediocre physical skills, but I think he is serviceable and even if he should get unseated next year as the starting RG, he'll still be a valuable player IMHO.

I also like Cornell Green as a solid veteran OT than can spot start and run-block like a demon.

Bottom Line? We need to add at least 1 notable veteran starter, whether it's LT or C is immaterial to me and it might be worthwhile to trade a 2009 draft pick to move up and grab a promising OL in round 3.
 
Byron2112 said:
I wonder if Faneca could play center?

A smart, hardworking guy like that would do good leading... could probably get a few good seasons outta him in the pivot.
Click to expand...
As much as I would like Faneca's attitude here, there is no way we can afford him. He is going to ask for the world to back up a truck with all their money and some barrowed cash to make him happy.
Trust me, everything in local media here he wants the type of money Hutchinson got.....and we won't be paying that!!!!!!!!!\

Unless he wants to be a back up RB?
LOL
 
jatfly said:
As much as I would like Faneca's attitude here, there is no way we can afford him. He is going to ask for the world to back up a truck with all their money and some barrowed cash to make him happy.
Trust me, everything in local media here he wants the type of money Hutchinson got.....and we won't be paying that!!!!!!!!!\

Unless he wants to be a back up RB?
LOL
Click to expand...

Drafting guards is the way to go. They always have good value. You can get a good starter in Rnd 2 and develop a guy. I would much rather do that cheaply. Besides i think Carlisle and Gallery are both solid.
 
BigTron said:
Drafting guards is the way to go. They always have good value. You can get a good starter in Rnd 2 and develop a guy. I would much rather do that cheaply. Besides i think Carlisle and Gallery are both solid.
Click to expand...
I am with ya there I think Guard is the least of our O-Line worries.....we need the RT and LT and maybe even a new Center?
 
Rep to Stanny. it's nice to bring up the line, because, for the problems they have had this year, they are light years ahead of last year.

Credit Kiffin for bringing in Cable, and Cable for putting it together. I look forward to seeing what happens next year.

If Gallery can run shit at LG, great. I don't care where he was drafted, I just want to see him help this team, guard, tackle, wherever.

The pass pro needs to improve for sure, and I am sure a center and another tackle are on the wish list. I was pleasantly surprised by Cornell Green, and look to see more of McSexy and Mario H (and a handsomer couple you will never find).

But really, the run-blocking has been a revelation. Justin Fargas--stud. :eek:

When thinking about improving this offense, I wonder about spending high picks on linemen and running backs. The Broncos never spent high picks on OT's or RB's, they went more for the system. If we can get 1,200 yard production from Fargas/Bush (still not sold on him), why not use a 1st rounder on a defensive player?
 
Nice work Stan --

I couldn't agree more. LT and C are weak spots. Sims is old and slow and Newberry is old and slow - what more needs to be said. We have to take a look at Mario next season after spending this year's 3rd on him so if McFug can continue his stronghold on the RT spot we'll be seing Henderson manning the left side. Gallery keeps getting better, thank God, and Carlisle is fine. That leaves a big hole at C. Keep Newbs as a backup and go out and draft the best center you can (I looked at the list of o-lineman free agents and don't see any centers!). As HP pointed out, that cat from Cal looks like a player and maybe could be had on day 2.
 
I think more credit needs to go to our O-Line for there kick ass run blocking this season. Cable and Fargas have been getting their due, but the line has doen very well. They went from a bunch of pussies to nasty run blockers in one year!

Gallery is a mauler in the run game. No doubt. If you watch him pull out and hit someone on a sweep etc. you'll forget about some of those shitty plays last year. I think Gallery has finally turned the corner and is now FINALLY starting to play with a nasty streak. He still is shaky in pass protection but that isnt as huge of a deal for Guards IMO. If he can get push in the run game, cut down the penalties then he will be fine. He is obviously athletic enough to pull outside and run or get to the second level and block. He didnt lose those skills he came out of college with, they were just underutilized to this point.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top